Have recently bought a CQ350 mount for use with my GSO RC12 and I having an issue with the mount.
I wonder if anyone out there can help with advice and/or experience.
This is the
1) When the RA drive clutch [not the best design in the world] is locked, there is still some significant (few mm) play in the RA axis. Much more than in the Dec axis when also locked.
2) When tracking, the mount can jumps (within the period of one 5s guide exposure up to 8-10arcsecs in RA away from the guide stars. While the A/G can bring it back, this destroys the image. Left unguided, I can see a series of steps [typically 3 - 4] during a 600 sec exposure.
3) That is the worst case scenario, most times so far the tracking is better - but always appreciably worse in RA (0.7-1arcsec rms) compared to Dec (0.3-0.5arcsec rms)
4) I have attempted to see in this correlates to anything. Initially I thought is was worse at large HAs, but last night it perfromed poorly all night of a field crossing the meridian at local midnight. I have have a weather station, at there could be some indication that these jumps are caused by wind, although the maximum gust detected during the worse nights was around 20kph. [The telescope is in an observatory, although the top of the scope does protrude above the walls when in operation.
5) A cables are firmly seated and do not interfere with the motion of the scope.
The supplier has said it is not a mount issue, and that I probably have the wrong parameters in PhD2. This is surprising to me, as the mount appears to behave in a similar fashion with or without guiding.
So I thought I would try my AB friends to see if anyone has experienced anything similar?
Does this amount of play in the RA drive seem acceptable?
Is wind loading at < 20kph a serious issue?
Can wind only affect one axis?
Thanks for you help.
Brian
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Did you solve your issues with the cq350?
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Nope, it is the mount issue. Sky Watcher will always say that it's user's error though. After talking back and fourth for more than a month for the exact same issue you have, I sent it out for a repair. They did fix that play you mentioned, but totally broke the mount DEC axis when reassembling. I ended up returning and got a CEM70, and zero problems since then.
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huh?
I literally have changed my mind like 100 times in regards to choosing a mount; I finally chose the CQ350, and now I hear this? (I'm lucky I haven't bought it yet though)
I wouldn't be surprised if WW3 comes and I still haven't chosen a mount… that would be depressing.
okayyyy, back to forum posting again.
but thx for telling us this.
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huh?
I literally have changed my mind like 100 times in regards to choosing a mount; I finally chose the CQ350, and now I hear this? (I'm lucky I haven't bought it yet though)
I wouldn't be surprised if WW3 comes and I still haven't chosen a mount... that would be depressing.
okayyyy, back to forum posting again.
but thx for telling us this. Well, I'd say it's excellent for the price if it works (the cheapest for the capacity). However, I've seen a lot of people experience the same issue as me. I started experiencing this issue after 3 nights. Guiding started jumping to 8arcsec, and after multiple testing which SkyWatcher requested, the tracking grew worse, unable to track anything even for 300mm FL refractor. At that time, the PE curve showed more than ±100arcsec error. I dont want to discourage people from buying SkyWatcher products since their EQ6-R is such a great mount. But their support really disappointed me. Just one person to contact to, and he's busy a lot of times so long wait times expected.
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John Park:
Guiding started jumping to 8arcsec, and after multiple testing which SkyWatcher requested, the tracking grew worse, unable to track anything even for 300mm refractor. At that time, the PE curve showed more than ±100arcsec error. yeah, sounds like something my AVX would do started out by giving me 0.55" total RMS and now it's getting into the 2"-3" range with my best guide settings, which can longer work for my image scale; that's why I'm looking for a new mount thank you, no CQ350 for me anymore
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That's a backlash issue, the worm to gear spacing is incorrect. Not sure how to fix that on the CQ350.
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That's a backlash issue, the worm to gear spacing is incorrect. Not sure how to fix that on the CQ350. Yes, this is exactly the problem. This looks to grow over time as my experience with the mount, but I did see some people getting successful results without yhis as well. However, this mount assembly is just way too complex to open up and adjust anything. Even the repair techs broke the mount while assembling which proves the intricacy of the design. I think people who are experts may get away, but for a normal astrophotographer, certainly going to be a pain. An easy way would be sending it to Skywatcher, but that'll take a long time to get it back
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John Park:
That's a backlash issue, the worm to gear spacing is incorrect. Not sure how to fix that on the CQ350.
Yes, this is exactly the problem. This looks to grow over time as my experience with the mount, but I did see some people getting successful results without yhis as well. However, this mount assembly is just way too complex to open up and adjust anything. Even the repair techs broke the mount while assembling which proves the intricacy of the design. I think people who are experts may get away, but for a normal astrophotographer, certainly going to be a pain. An easy way would be sending it to Skywatcher, but that'll take a long time to get it back CQ350 Pro is like a BMW. Very nice, Cool to look at, Performs great- When it isn't blowing head gaskets.
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huh?
I literally have changed my mind like 100 times in regards to choosing a mount; I finally chose the CQ350, and now I hear this? (I'm lucky I haven't bought it yet though)
I wouldn't be surprised if WW3 comes and I still haven't chosen a mount... that would be depressing.
okayyyy, back to forum posting again.
but thx for telling us this. No matter what mount you buy you will hear bad things about them. Not every single mount, from every manufacturer performs flawlessly. There is lemons out there. Even from paramount etc. If your going to just ditch buying a piece of equipment every time someone posts about it, then you will never buy any astrophotography gear and you will be forever posting about it, looking for the flawless equipment. (You have already said you changed your mind 100 times. Dont kill yourself making a simple decision. If you get a mount and it has actual issues that cannot be fixed, worry about it then). What will you get next? Ioptron? Those had issues as well. Celestron mounts? Same thing there, those had issues too. I suggest just getting the mount that best fits your needs, and not worry about the reviews. Far more people will post about their negative experiences, than those who have no issues at all. If mounts from these companies were really that awful, then they would no longer be in the game anymore, yet they are still here.
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Had exactly the same issue with ours. Explained it all to the dealer with autoguiding logs and they paid to return it and replaced straight away with a new one which performs well with no nasty spikes in the guiding. I really like the mount. Brilliant service with Testar in Australia. Credit where its due!
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Daniel DeSclafani:
huh?
I literally have changed my mind like 100 times in regards to choosing a mount; I finally chose the CQ350, and now I hear this? (I'm lucky I haven't bought it yet though)
I wouldn't be surprised if WW3 comes and I still haven't chosen a mount... that would be depressing.
okayyyy, back to forum posting again.
but thx for telling us this.
No matter what mount you buy you will hear bad things about them. Not every single mount, from every manufacturer performs flawlessly. There is lemons out there. Even from paramount etc.
If your going to just ditch buying a piece of equipment every time someone posts about it, then you will never buy any astrophotography gear and you will be forever posting about it, looking for the flawless equipment. (You have already said you changed your mind 100 times. Dont kill yourself making a simple decision. If you get a mount and it has actual issues that cannot be fixed, worry about it then).
What will you get next? Ioptron? Those had issues as well. Celestron mounts? Same thing there, those had issues too.
I suggest just getting the mount that best fits your needs, and not worry about the reviews. Far more people will post about their negative experiences, than those who have no issues at all. If mounts from these companies were really that awful, then they would no longer be in the game anymore, yet they are still here. you're right now I'm looking at the Losmandy G11G; it looks to be a good mount from a good company with good customer service maybe I'm just paranoid, but I wont look for Asian mounts anymore
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you're right
now I'm looking at the Losmandy G11G; it looks to be a good mount from a good company with good customer service
maybe I'm just paranoid, but I wont look for Asian mounts anymore I can't see how anyone can go wrong buying this mount. Losmandy has a multiple-decade track record of exceptional support and quality. If you can handle the weight and cost then you can be assured of tracking performance ... At least this is my opinion :-)
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I have been using this mount now for 6 months and I have no issues with it. There is "backlash" in the RA (You can adjust this easily if you want to). I didn't bother since RA does not reverse and when tracking/guiding the gears will always be meshed. My guiding is .3" - .4" consistently. Backlash is not a bad thing, its actually desireable to a degree, too tight of mesh will cause premature wear or binding because metal expands and contracts. There will always be some, its just a matter of being able to measure how much. Guiding compensates for this to a degree.
I have owned 5 EQ6 an EQ8 and the CQ350 and all have performed well for me. I hear people sometimes get a bad mount, I have had one and it was a CEM70.
I wouldn't hesitate to buy any Skywatcher mount.
As for the losmandy, there are many stories about those out there. There are many stories about many mounts.
Also anytime a telescope of that size is protruding outside of your walls, expect poor guiding if its windy. My 12" RC was on the EQ8 and I did not have issues under 20k but the EQ8 is much beefier. Above 20k good luck. May as well take up another hobby until the wind dies down.
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Apologies for not replying sooner. I did get a replacement and it works better. At best I get 0.4arcsec in Dec and 0.6arcsec rms in RA. This occurs during “good” seeing nights of 3arcsec. On worse nights (up to 6” seeing) tracking goes off to 1arcsec. Alarmingly there are still signifcant - although less frequent 4-8arcsec excursions, irrespective of seeing.
My supplier simply says I cant expect any better from an “inexpensive” mount.
In 20knot + winds I close.
My OP was less about the quality of the CQ350 as a mount, merely whether anyone had experienced similar issues with theirs. It turns they have which means that there is an issue with the QC. If you are happy to accept that, in return for a less expensive mount, that it your choice. Living in a remote area, returning stuff is quite challenging, so I am not inclined to do it a second time. Based on my experience of Skywatcher mounts. EQ6-R pro EQ5R (both great) EQM35 (junk) and the CQ350, if I ever buy another mount it is unlikely to be a Skywatcher. Just too high a failure rate for the money.
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Stargazers SA - Andrew:
Had exactly the same issue with ours. Explained it all to the dealer with autoguiding logs and they paid to return it and replaced straight away with a new one which performs well with no nasty spikes in the guiding. I really like the mount. Brilliant service with Testar in Australia. Credit where its due! This was my supplier. I returned mine in March. At the time I returned mine they could only give me a model that had been used for testing. Looks like they got more in with identical problems. Cs Brian
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Brian Boyle:
My supplier simply says I cant expect any better from an “inexpensive” mount. wow, I wonder what that guy's salary was
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Lot of people will have different experiences with these mounts. I personally used two CQ350s which turned out all defective, and three CEM70s which all worked perfectly. But one thing to make sure is to buy from supplier that allows easy return/exchanges. It doesnt make sense to send out a new purchased mount for repair.
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Hey guys I have had the issue with the CQ-350 and skywatcher told me I’m on my own. So I dismantled it and am now looking for a worm drive block assembly. I shot a 30 minute video documenting how to dismantle the mount without breaking anything. Here is the link to the video. https://youtu.be/VP4NSlAtMD4?si=2stlgbLjkL4HdjMiif anyone knows how to get parts, please let me know because I’m having a hard time.
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Daniel DeSclafani:
huh?
I literally have changed my mind like 100 times in regards to choosing a mount; I finally chose the CQ350, and now I hear this? (I'm lucky I haven't bought it yet though)
I wouldn't be surprised if WW3 comes and I still haven't chosen a mount... that would be depressing.
okayyyy, back to forum posting again.
but thx for telling us this.
No matter what mount you buy you will hear bad things about them. Not every single mount, from every manufacturer performs flawlessly. There is lemons out there. Even from paramount etc.
If your going to just ditch buying a piece of equipment every time someone posts about it, then you will never buy any astrophotography gear and you will be forever posting about it, looking for the flawless equipment. (You have already said you changed your mind 100 times. Dont kill yourself making a simple decision. If you get a mount and it has actual issues that cannot be fixed, worry about it then).
What will you get next? Ioptron? Those had issues as well. Celestron mounts? Same thing there, those had issues too.
I suggest just getting the mount that best fits your needs, and not worry about the reviews. Far more people will post about their negative experiences, than those who have no issues at all. If mounts from these companies were really that awful, then they would no longer be in the game anymore, yet they are still here. Very well said. Also there are a lot of variants that can dictate poor guiding and most of the times it's not the mount's fault... My CQ350 always worked great, guinding is consistent around 0.4-0.6 everytime, and I totally recomend it.
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Mine has developed a similar problem. I haven't had a night with it to nail down the issue, but the last two times I used it, after a meridian flip, I would get large spikes in RA. They occur every few minutes. My setup is the same as in previous imaging sessions, and I'm sure it's not a guiding issue. Previously, I would guide around 0.5 and lower. I'm hoping it magically disappears, but not likely.
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I don't have a CQ350, but I do have lots of experience with drive systems. Watched Nicks video and I'm wondering if the problem is the belt walking over and rubbing against the block wall.
Nick: does the sound coincide with the belt contacting the wall? Don't know how much faith to put in the feel of roughness during hand rotation - the motor looks like a stepper which would feel notchy even when new and perfect.
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Nick Fritz:
Hey guys I have had the issue with the CQ-350 and skywatcher told me I’m on my own. So I dismantled it and am now looking for a worm drive block assembly. I shot a 30 minute video documenting how to dismantle the mount without breaking anything. Here is the link to the video. https://youtu.be/VP4NSlAtMD4?si=2stlgbLjkL4HdjMi
if anyone knows how to get parts, please let me know because I’m having a hard time. Hi Nick, Nice video - we did a similar exercise with our CQ 350 that is currently located in our remote observatory in Namibia. We had to describe the whole disassembly process to let the staff do the service. After 8 Months of intense (-> every night!) use, we had the following issues: 1. Broken RA Motor Shaft (broken inside the motor housing!!!) 2. Worn off RA Belt 3. Regular Spikes in RA (regular, but still depending on the position of the scope) We were able to fix the first two issues because we had spare parts place (the motors are the same as in the EQ6-R, by the way). The third one is still pending, and it is very likely the same issue that you have / describe in your video. Based on different failed parts we can already tell, that Skywatcher did a a really bad job in designing this mount, as obviously the parts are getting worn off a lot and there seems to be a high lateral pull on the worm / gears / motors / bearings, which leads those cheap parts to fail over time. I have to tell that this is sadly also the worst mount to service that I have ever worked with - you cannot even replace the belt without taking the whole thing apart!!! Some comments on your approach: 1. It is not necessary to disassemble the DEC side or the saddle to remove the RA block (including motor and worm). 2. You have to remove the RA cover (make sure to not damage the RA homing sensor!) 3. You have to remove little round RA cover that is screwed in on the side (in your video you mentioned, that you tried to open it, but you did not continue, because it was stuck) Behind the cover on the side you will find brass coloured axis that is holding the whole RA block - you can screw it loose after you have removed the small round RA cover! From your analysis I would say that the ball bearings of the worm are damaged. I am not an engineer, but these should be of type "608 2z". I would recommend to replace these bearings by some high quality ones (e.g. from SKF) - they should just be a few bucks each. Best Regards, Nico
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Yes you are absolutely right. I did take off way too much. I couldn’t tell from just looking and I really wanted to find the noise/issue while opened up and still connected. I knew I would do some things that were unnecessary in the end but now I know lol.
I very much appreciate your response because it does get me going in a direction now and I believe the right direction. Skywatcher has just dropped me basically. I work in customer service so I am very patient and not rude about things. For whatever reason they are not communicating or letting me buy parts as crazy as that sounds. So I need to basically remove the rest of the worm block and source the parts I need. If it’s the drive motor then the eq6 will work? I’m assuming those can be found. Also I have one more question for you. On that ra cover plug, how do you remove it? It unscrewed half a turn and stopped. Does it pull out or I gotta keep unscrewing?
Thanks again as your knowledge is very valuable. I will shoot more video on this as I remove more and replace the parts to get going again. Also you described the issue perfectly as well. Likely you have the same thing happening that I do.
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