Well after this latest Nor Easter I'm ready to re-locate to a warmer and darker environment. I haven't been able to image since Christmas. I'm sure someone has done the research to determine the best sites to set up shop for astrophotography. I'm thinking Arizona, New Mexico, or Texas. Important metrics that come to mind are number of cloudless nights per year, Bortle value, seeing conditions. I'm not averse to the idea of an astronomy village, I seem to remember there is at least one in the south west.
Thanks for any input.
Dan
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Yeah, weather's a pain, sucks not being able to image for a while. Here's some places based on living in these places for a good bit of my short life. Colorado is nice, I live here currently. Since we typically have crystal clear skies, and less air to look through, but the mountain vorticies can cause some issues when it comes to seeing The reduced air density actually midigates the light pollution, I'm less than 20mi from Denver, in south eastern littleton, but my LP is Bortle class 5. Colorado doesnt actually get much snow at all anymore, its typically just hits of 3-10 inches at most once a month in the winter and it clears out in a week. We get about 300 cloudless nights a year, and typically have fully transparant skies. The real issue with Colorado is the price of living, its really bad, and is only getting worse as time goes by. Almost the entirety of colorado south of the springs is Bortle class 1-3, and since its further south, weather is more pleasant. Nevada is another good place, they see pretty decent amounts of cloudless nights. My dad lives in Boulder City, and that place is fantastic for astronomy, I expected it to be like Bortle 5 or 6, but its actually bortle 3, with most of the Milky Way extremely bright and clear. Plus you get the benefit of paying less taxes than many people = more gear  Arizona is also pretty nice, as is Texas- theres some places around Wichita Springs that are pure Bortle 1, so dark that the planets and sirius will hurt your dark adaption. New Mexico is beautiful.
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Dan, Save a seat for me ….
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Looking at the annual cloud cover maps for the USA, the best bet is always going to be southern Arizona, New Mexico, and Southern California. I grew up in Cave Creek on the north side of the Phoenix valley, which has a huge percentage clear nights but seeing can get a bit iffy in the summer. I think the area around Portal/Animas is going to be the best balance of seeing and clearness you will find in the Arizona area. There are other locations like Happy Jack, where the large DCT is located which has really nice seeing conditions compared to Phoenix, but may have less clear skies. Other Southwestern states do have dark skies like Nevada, but I will caution you that the seeing conditions likely won't be as stable, and it will be very windy in many places. My list of towns would be something like: 1. Portal 2. Animas 3. Happy Jack 4. St George 5. Anza Borrego 6. Joshua Tree But depends on how rural or metropolitan you want to get. I just made a long video discussing geography and how it impacts astronomy/astrophotography, you may be interested to watch: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0WjQFb2qCVE&t=1267s |
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Thanks for the info Bray, I will check out that video. I really like Arizona, visited twice. I also love hummingbird photography. There is only one species here, AZ has around seven, I believe.
Hey Jay, how much snow did you get? At least 14" here. Lost power for over 12 hours.
Dan
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Hi Dan, I've been imaging in Rio Rancho, New Mexico for many years, having moved from the snow and cold of Colorado. Rio Rancho is about 15 miles north of Albuquerque, and my skies are Bortle 6 east of meridian, and 3-4 west, so I shoot primarily west. The summers, obviously, can get very warm, especially July and August. Winters are certainly not bad - daytime temps in the 30s to 40s in the coldest months, nighttime temps anywhere from ~10 to the mid 30s in the same period. Snow in this part of New Mexico is minimal; if we get 3-5 inches out of a storm, that's pretty rare, and it's usually always gone by next day. When the Spring and Autumn winds get howling, they can kick up dust pretty well. It is the desert, so sand is plentiful, especially in the 'Heights" where I am. There are trees, but other types of foliage can be scarce. While the skies are certainly not jet-black, we are close enough to a semi-major metropolis for health and other facilities. With current advancements in processing software, I've been pleased with the results I've gotten in my permanent roll-off facility. Hope this helps. It just all depends on what you'll need for a balance of life and good skies. All the best, Steve  |
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Dan,
I also concluded the same as you and did a fair amount of research on the subject. Since I was just retired and my wife is able to work from just about anywhere, I though we would be fairly free to relocate. I traveled to sites and employed a couple realtors as well. Even put an offer down! But an illness struck me and that plan has been put on hold.
In any case, if you are looking for low light pollution, the SW is certainly a great place, but of course depends on where you want to locate or can locate too. I live in Oregon, on the rainy side of the Cascade range, so have not had the equipment out since early November. You think you have it rough!? Oddly, the whole of eastern Oregon has a vast area of Bortle 1 skies. But it is really the middle of nowhere and you better like high desert living.
I can share a lot of the research that I did when I was planning on moving. First of all, my wife and I really liked the northern NM area. A place that we could settle, and not far from a major airport for travel. Also, we like to ski. And also, the elevation means it will not be 119 degrees in the summer. I actually thought we could buy a house for living in northern NM and then a cabin in the area of southwest NM to put an observatory that I could operate remotely, or on weekend or longer stays. You can't beat Bortle 1 skies and they truely are wonderful to see. Better than when I was on the side of Mauna Kea. The drawback of the area is it can be remote, little cell service and winds can be an issue. I also suspect that the seeing can be problematic in the area. But it is an astronomer's mecca. Look up the SkyPi remote observatory. I also liked the area just over the border in Arizona. Both have altitude, so the benefit of moderate summer temperatures (but snow in winter) and it is above at least some of the atmosphere. I suspect that the seeing there would be somewhat challenged just like the close by NM. But still great.
Among the best seeing is in the mountains of southern California. The air coming in off the pacific is a very deep stable airmass. The challenge is to find a place far enough away from the very large cities, with very extensive light domes. But they exist and there are a number of commercial observatories because of this. Again, this is (normally!) a very dry area and many clear nights. I don't think the seeing can be beat. Partly because of the deep stable airmass, and partly due to the altitude.
I have heard that certain parts of Florida have had quality seeing conditions. Again, deep stable airmass. But things may have changed over time with development.
I had tagged the NM, AZ area so that I could get as many consecutive nights of observing in as possible. This was because I wanted to set up an robotic observing system for routine and highly repetitive photometry. However, in addition to that, I wanted to continue to do some imaging for a fun aside. And being further south has its benefits regarding seeing more of the universe. The farther north you go, the more excluded you are from those southern targets that are so wonderful. Worst really is the far north. So if you are going to move, then you might consider latitude as part of the equation.
Best of luck!
Alan
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You can cross this map with another map of sunny days per year and will end up with good candidate locations: https://www.lightpollutionmap.infoYou can also look where the best remote commercial observatories are located.
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Hi Dan,
I've been imaging in Rio Rancho, New Mexico for many years, having moved from the snow and cold of Colorado. Rio Rancho is about 15 miles north of Albuquerque, and my skies are Bortle 6 east of meridian, and 3-4 west, so I shoot primarily west. The summers, obviously, can get very warm, especially July and August. Winters are certainly not bad - daytime temps in the 30s to 40s in the coldest months, nighttime temps anywhere from ~10 to the mid 30s in the same period. Snow in this part of New Mexico is minimal; if we get 3-5 inches out of a storm, that's pretty rare, and it's usually always gone by next day. When the Spring and Autumn winds get howling, they can kick up dust pretty well.
It is the desert, so sand is plentiful, especially in the 'Heights" where I am. There are trees, but other types of foliage can be scarce.
While the skies are certainly not jet-black, we are close enough to a semi-major metropolis for health and other facilities.
With current advancements in processing software, I've been pleased with the results I've gotten in my permanent roll-off facility.
Hope this helps. It just all depends on what you'll need for a balance of life and good skies.
All the best,
Steve Proximity to amenities is convenient, but it comes with neighbors unfortunately. I like your observatory. Have you made any posts about it? Dan
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Alan Brunelle:
Dan,
I also concluded the same as you and did a fair amount of research on the subject. Since I was just retired and my wife is able to work from just about anywhere, I though we would be fairly free to relocate. I traveled to sites and employed a couple realtors as well. Even put an offer down! But an illness struck me and that plan has been put on hold.
In any case, if you are looking for low light pollution, the SW is certainly a great place, but of course depends on where you want to locate or can locate too. I live in Oregon, on the rainy side of the Cascade range, so have not had the equipment out since early November. You think you have it rough!? Oddly, the whole of eastern Oregon has a vast area of Bortle 1 skies. But it is really the middle of nowhere and you better like high desert living.
I can share a lot of the research that I did when I was planning on moving. First of all, my wife and I really liked the northern NM area. A place that we could settle, and not far from a major airport for travel. Also, we like to ski. And also, the elevation means it will not be 119 degrees in the summer. I actually thought we could buy a house for living in northern NM and then a cabin in the area of southwest NM to put an observatory that I could operate remotely, or on weekend or longer stays. You can't beat Bortle 1 skies and they truely are wonderful to see. Better than when I was on the side of Mauna Kea. The drawback of the area is it can be remote, little cell service and winds can be an issue. I also suspect that the seeing can be problematic in the area. But it is an astronomer's mecca. Look up the SkyPi remote observatory. I also liked the area just over the border in Arizona. Both have altitude, so the benefit of moderate summer temperatures (but snow in winter) and it is above at least some of the atmosphere. I suspect that the seeing there would be somewhat challenged just like the close by NM. But still great.
Among the best seeing is in the mountains of southern California. The air coming in off the pacific is a very deep stable airmass. The challenge is to find a place far enough away from the very large cities, with very extensive light domes. But they exist and there are a number of commercial observatories because of this. Again, this is (normally!) a very dry area and many clear nights. I don't think the seeing can be beat. Partly because of the deep stable airmass, and partly due to the altitude.
I have heard that certain parts of Florida have had quality seeing conditions. Again, deep stable airmass. But things may have changed over time with development.
I had tagged the NM, AZ area so that I could get as many consecutive nights of observing in as possible. This was because I wanted to set up an robotic observing system for routine and highly repetitive photometry. However, in addition to that, I wanted to continue to do some imaging for a fun aside. And being further south has its benefits regarding seeing more of the universe. The farther north you go, the more excluded you are from those southern targets that are so wonderful. Worst really is the far north. So if you are going to move, then you might consider latitude as part of the equation.
Best of luck!
Alan Good info Alan. Getting as far south as possible is an important consideration to get access to more of the sky. Dan
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You can cross this map with another map of sunny days per year and will end up with good candidate locations:
https://www.lightpollutionmap.info
You can also look where the best remote commercial observatories are located. That was something I was planning to do but I was going to add a hummingbird map too ;) Dan
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If you're still in your working years, Arizona has one important tiebreaker–no $%^&#@! Daylight Savings Time. Your skies are totally dark by 9 p.m. even on the summer solstice. The range in elevation of AZ (or NM) allows one to customize the climate. Heck, if you want, you can put a summer home and a winter home an hour apart.
West Texas in the Big Bend / Alpine / Marathon / Terlingua region is incredibly dark. It also has the added advantage of being the furthest south one can get in the continental United States and still be in a desert climate. Parts of the Big Bend region get down to around 29°N latitude. Again, elevation determines your climate here, but if you're around Alpine (~4,000-ft elevation), your summers are typically 90°F / 60°F for avg. high/low and the "winter" averages 60°F/30°F.
I put "winter" in quotes because…sorry, Texas, but what you call, "winter"…ISN'T.
West Texas is, though, remote even by desert standards.
Regardless, if you don't already have an autofocuser, GET ONE if you move to desert SW. Temperature-induced focus drift is more of a problem there vs. the Eastern U.S.
Speaking of the Eastern U.S., you might want to consider more rural parts of the Carolinas or Georgia, too. It's at least an improvement over the northeastern U.S. You don't have to shovel heat and humidity.
Clear Skies,
Phil
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Phil Creed:
If you're still in your working years, Arizona has one important tiebreaker--no $%^&#@! Daylight Savings Time. Your skies are totally dark by 9 p.m. even on the summer solstice. The range in elevation of AZ (or NM) allows one to customize the climate. Heck, if you want, you can put a summer home and a winter home an hour apart.
West Texas in the Big Bend / Alpine / Marathon / Terlingua region is incredibly dark. It also has the added advantage of being the furthest south one can get in the continental United States and still be in a desert climate. Parts of the Big Bend region get down to around 29°N latitude. Again, elevation determines your climate here, but if you're around Alpine (~4,000-ft elevation), your summers are typically 90°F / 60°F for avg. high/low and the "winter" averages 60°F/30°F.
I put "winter" in quotes because...sorry, Texas, but what you call, "winter"...ISN'T.
West Texas is, though, remote even by desert standards.
Regardless, if you don't already have an autofocuser, GET ONE if you move to desert SW. Temperature-induced focus drift is more of a problem there vs. the Eastern U.S.
Speaking of the Eastern U.S., you might want to consider more rural parts of the Carolinas or Georgia, too. It's at least an improvement over the northeastern U.S. You don't have to shovel heat and humidity.
Clear Skies,
Phil I really liked the Flagstaff area. But housing costs were high. I think the University drives up the price of housing in mid sized cities. I know, because it's a similar situation where I live. Corvallis, OR. Oregon State U.
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Having worked in AZ for many years where there's access to great dark skies (2 hours east of Tucson), and then having retired for a few years in western CO, I eventually moved to a remote area of western NM near Pie Town. The area of western NM is remote, but close enough to easily hang out with folks from the Tucson Amateur Astronomy Association (TAAA), who have a nice facility in southern AZ near the NM border. The area near Pie Town is pretty astro friendly (evidenced by the number of domes in a particular subdivision just west of town). Nice place with Bortle 1 skies at high elevation if you don't mind being subject to limited dining choices and a drive for gas/groceries. I've only been here for less than a year, but it's a very nice place to image. That said, the weather here has been a bit wetter this year than I expected with all those CA atmospheric weather events spilling southward. From what I hear from friends in Tucson, AZ hasn't fared any better….they had a good monsoon last year and it's been pretty iffy for astroimaging all winter. IMHO, western US is about as good as it gets. If you can handle remote, AZ or NM has some real advantages related to both imaging and astro-friendly communities and infrastructure. CS Doug S.
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Yeah, tell me about that recent snowstorm. I ended up with 20 inches of heavy, wet snow that damaged every tree and bush on my property here in eastern NY state. After it was over, I got a completely clear night, but there was an avalanche hanging over my patio that would have destroyed my rig if it came down. Then I got a nasty head cold and didn't want to image. Welcome to upstate NY in the winter. Next time I get 20 inches, let it be a Planewave CDK! Please! I formerly lived in west Texas (Lubbock area), and I have made many dark site trips from that location, including three to New Mexico. I would vastly prefer southern New Mexico due to the low particle (dust) count in the air and the much lower frequency of windy days. In west Texas, August through October was best. November-January mostly turned out to have wickedly bad seeing and some wind. February through April was another "primetime" season if the wind behaved itself, but it often did not. On a windy day, the sky turns brown, and my images would be affected badly, even if the wind calmed down before sunset. May was a good month unless there were thunderstorms. Late May into June was the cloudiest time of the year. Sometimes forest fire smoke ruined imaging all summer long, just like anywhere else in the country. As you can see, west Texas is hardly a year-round picnic, because many of the nights that look clear on a satellite image are actually poor for imaging. In New Mexico, gusty wind and brown skies are much less likely than on the southern plains, but windy days do happen. I'm not sure about going further south in Texas - perhaps the wind/dust problem is less severe around Fort Davis or Big Bend? The trouble with Big Bend is that's there's essentially no civilization nearby, so good luck living there. Avoid the Permian Basin (Midland/Odessa/Carlsbad) because the oil/gas industry has so many flares that the skies are not actually very dark. My three trips to New Mexico were just astonishing. Nowhere in west Texas could compare to the darkness and transparency I experienced at 7500 ft. elevation in southern NM. The trouble was that I had average seeing on one night, and poor seeing on two nights, so the images I recorded were worse than what I could have gotten at home in TX. Local topography is a really big deal in mountainous areas, and setting up downwind of a mountain range is lethal. Mixing of warm desert air with cold air descending from the mountains is a recipe for poor seeing. In the summer, afternoon thunderstorms form over the mountains, ruining virtually every night for imaging if you happen to be downwind. Even when the clouds finally clear out, the seeing is terrible due to convection overhead. Overall, my advice would be to find a location in NM that has somewhat flat land to the west and southwest of it. The prevailing winds are from the southwest, so you'll get a nice, stable layer of air flowing over your location. Combine good seeing with ridiculous numbers of clear nights, even in the winter, and you'll move back to the northeast in 5 years after running out of DSOs to image.  |
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Dan:
Proximity to amenities is convenient, but it comes with neighbors unfortunately. I like your observatory. Have you made any posts about it?
Dan Yes indeed, neighbors are a great consideration. I'm lucky to have side neighbors who are very considerate of their exterior lighting; when, they found out what I was doing, they were more than happy to be obliging. It also helps to have them over from time to time to do a bit of observing. So again, for me, the balance of closeness to facilities, with very tolerable skies, weather, etc. balances things out. No, I haven't posted anything about the observatory. I had an article in the AL's newsletter a few years ago, and I answer questions here about my facility if asked, but nothing outward. Steve
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Lots of good information, thank you all.
Dan
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https://www.darksky.org/our-work/conservation/idsp/communities/ Need to take that list with a grain of salt. Having the designation is not necessarily as idealistic as it should be. I personally know of at least one community in CO actively working on obtaining the designation for strictly business / profit motives. They light up the town with a GIGANTIC white sign on the canyon wall for months before and after Christmas that takes the term light intrusion to a whole new level! Seeing at least a couple neighboring regional towns in CO on the list....call me suspicious that IDSA may not be quite as picky as they once were. Politics and business for both IDSA and the involved communities.....
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Bray Falls:
I grew up in Cave Creek on the north side of the Phoenix valley @Bray Falls There's at least two of us! Don't know how old you are, but when I recently came back to visit I barely recognized the place. Regardless, was a great place to grow up. Dan - it depends on how much you care about access to services (and other humans). If your only criteria is dark, relatively stable and clear, Southeast Az, Grand Canyon area, West-Central NM, Southern-Central-Eastern Utah, most of Nevada will all fit the bill. I'd throw Southwest Colorado in there, but after this winter, maybe not so much.
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